Electrical Wiring Help Needed Please

[Buds Buddy]

OK all you groovy guys & dolls out there sky high in your weed wonderland. I need your HELP !!!
I'm in the process of converting my shed into a grow room. The previous owner of this place was growing (found plenty of evidence) & he ran electric to the shed. However I don't think what he did is safe. There's no breaker dedicated to the shed. He tied into a breaker that says Bedroom. That breaker powers 2 bedrooms & the lights in the laundry room. It's only a 15 amp breaker.
My Breaker Box is rated at 200 Amps but all the breaker slots are full. Is it possible to add a second breaker box (in the Shed) & connect it to the main wiring to the breaker box in the house & is this safe ? My entire power draw for the shed only needs to be about 40 Amps.
I know I can do all the wiring inside the shed to the new breaker box. Just not sure if the Shed Breaker box can be connected to the main wiring on the house breaker box.
Any info on this would be of great help. Already invested $1000 in turning this shed into a grow room so I have to find a way to make this work & safely. Thanks in advance !!!

 

[Chris Scorpio]

Good job for an electrician for sure

 

[buzz62]

For 40 amps you will need heavier wire as a 15 amp 14/2 wire will not do. In Canada you can put in another mains circuit panel and connect it directly to your supply, bypassing your current house panel. Definitely a job for an electrician. There are also half width breakers that can go in some panels if they are full. 40 amps is a lot. Big grow? Air-conditioning? My grow is using 1400 watts of LED lights plus a few baseboard heaters and fans and all in all takes about 30 amps on a cold day. However, I am heating the room to 74F while outside its minus 30 F!! Probably not an issue in AZ!

 

[Buds Buddy]

Good job for an electrician for sure

Yes it would be if you want to spend $1500. Not that rich ... LOL. I just need to know if this can be done & what size wire I need to run from one breaker box to the other if it can be done. Once I run the wiring I'll call an electrician to connect the wiring from one breaker box to the other & test it to make sure it's safe. The rest I prefer to do myself.

 

[Chris Scorpio]

Google baby

Lol


“Twelve-gauge wire is good for 20 amps, 10-gauge wire is good for 30 amps, 8-gauge is good for 40 amps, and 6-gauge is good for 55 amps,” and “The circuit breaker or fuse is always sized to protect the conductor

 

[greenjeans]

It is probably best to go from your house panel to another small panel in the shed. If you put a complete separate service - that means two electric bills - usually way more per month. But you are going to need to find 2 or 4 spaces on your house panel for another breaker. Probably not the news you were hoping for.

 

[shottafire]

You need to free up space in the main panel to add a 40 amp sub panel service to your shed. It should be fairly easy to do just have to take those two bedrooms and laundry room and put them on an existing circuit that has low draw.

 

[Buds Buddy]

For 40 amps you will need heavier wire as a 15 amp 14/2 wire will not do. In Canada you can put in another mains circuit panel and connect it directly to your supply, bypassing your current house panel. Definitely a job for an electrician. There are also half width breakers that can go in some panels if they are full. 40 amps is a lot. Big grow? Air-conditioning? My grow is using 1400 watts of LED lights plus a few baseboard heaters and fans and all in all takes about 30 amps on a cold day. However, I am heating the room to 74F while outside its minus 30 F!! Probably not an issue in AZ!

So I can put in a 2nd Breaker Box ? Is this what they are calling a sub-panel ? I don't actually need 40 Amps. Just want it there in case I use power tools, etc. I could probably get away with 25 - 30 amps but I'd rather have more than needed than not enough.
Lowest Temps I've seen is about 30 F & the hottest was 123 F. Heat is more of an issue than cold.
But using HPS for 3 months (1 grow in winter) will put off enough heat to suffice. Or maybe my supply will last long enough to take a 3 month break .... Yeah Right.
I'm looking to just wire everything & then call this A/C guy I know to connect it to the main wiring.
I'm not touching that. But I'll connect all the rest that doesn't have the power to it yet.

 

[shottafire]

Take a pic of your panel and I would go through and figure out what each breaker is going to unless it’s labeled neatly. Which most residential panels are not labeled correctly and neatly especially older homes that have had work done In the past.

 

[Buds Buddy]

It is probably best to go from your house panel to another small panel in the shed. If you put a complete separate service - that means two electric bills - usually way more per month. But you are going to need to find 2 or 4 spaces on your house panel for another breaker. Probably not the news you were hoping for.

OK, so I'll run everything to the house breaker box & then call my A/C friend to do the rest. He'll probably hook it up for $50 for me.

 

[Buds Buddy]

Take a pic of your panel and I would go through and figure out what each breaker is going to unless it’s labeled neatly. Which most residential panels are not labeled correctly and neatly especially older homes that have had work done In the past.

Yes, I found a breaker that's marked for something I don't even have so maybe I could use that spot.
I'll have to take the cover off to see what's going on in there.

 

[TurboBucket]

Google baby

Lol


“Twelve-gauge wire is good for 20 amps, 10-gauge wire is good for 30 amps, 8-gauge is good for 40 amps, and 6-gauge is good for 55 amps,” and “The circuit breaker or fuse is always sized to protect the conductor

Close, you have to derate the wire depending on how many conductors you have in the conduit and what the wire core is aluminum you need the next gauge higher.

I'm not an electrician but I know enough to say you need to call one for a sub panel install. Haha
They need to determine if your main can handle the additional load. They also have the big pullers that are necessary for running 6/3+ground cable, you could do it with single wires but it gets to be a bear without a spool jig.

I'm all for saving money where you can, some stuff is over a homeowners head though. I've been cautioned already about giving wiring advice on here, "for the safety of our members".

You can probably pick up a book at the orange box store, I'm sure there are some available online. Be sure to apply for a building permit and call for your inspections, they can make you tear it all back out and redo it if they really wanna be dicks.

 

[shottafire]

Yes, I found a breaker that's marked for something I don't even have so maybe I could use that spot.
I'll have to take the cover off to see what's going on in there.

There ya go. What kind of panel is it? How far away is shed from main panel?

 

[buzz62]

So I can put in a 2nd Breaker Box ? Is this what they are calling a sub-panel ? I don't actually need 40 Amps. Just want it there in case I use power tools, etc. I could probably get away with 25 - 30 amps but I'd rather have more than needed than not enough.
Lowest Temps I've seen is about 30 F & the hottest was 123 F. Heat is more of an issue than cold.
But using HPS for 3 months (1 grow in winter) will put off enough heat to suffice. Or maybe my supply will last long enough to take a 3 month break .... Yeah Right.
I'm looking to just wire everything & then call this A/C guy I know to connect it to the main wiring.
I'm not touching that. But I'll connect all the rest that doesn't have the power to it yet.

A sub panel will need breakers in your existing panel, and a mains panel will not, and a main will usually have two lines of 110 fed to it in case you need 220 for a baseboard heater or an air conditioner, whereas a sub panel sometimes is only one leg of 110.

 

[shottafire]

Close, you have to derate the wire depending on how many conductors you have in the conduit and what the wire core is aluminum you need the next gauge higher.

I'm not an electrician but I know enough to say you need to call one for a sub panel install. Haha
They need to determine if your main can handle the additional load. They also have the big pullers that are necessary for running 6/3+ground cable, you could do it with single wires but it gets to be a bear without a spool jig.

I'm all for saving money where you can, some stuff is over a homeowners head though. I've been cautioned already about giving wiring advice on here, "for the safety of our members".

You can probably pick up a book at the orange box store, I'm sure there are some available online. Be sure to apply for a building permit and call for your inspections, they can make you tear it all back out and redo it if they really wanna be dicks.

Your right turbo bucket giving people advice on electrical wiring is probably not the best idea. But what he needs is fairly simple and his ac buddy can probably point him in the right direction.

 

[Hydroholic]

I am a Licensed electrician. You have a couple of choices. Personally I would buy another small 6-8 circuit panel and install at your main panel. Install a 50 amp breaker and wire the new panel. This will require 2 spaces In your main panel. You can then move those circuits to the new sub panel. This will give you a few extra circuits. Then you can run a couple of circuits to the shed.

 

[Buds Buddy]

I am a Licensed electrician. You have a couple of choices. Personally I would buy another small 6-8 circuit panel and install at your main panel. Install a 50 amp breaker and wire the new panel. This will require 2 spaces In your main panel. You can then move those circuits to the new sub panel. This will give you a few extra circuits. Then you can run a couple of circuits to the shed.

This sounds like the easiest way yet. When you say 6-8 circuits do you mean circuits or slots ? I was looking at boxes & found some 100 Amp 8 slot 16 circuit breaker boxes for $15 & $20 New on Craigslist. Would this work ? If a box is rated 100 Amp do you have to use a 100 Amp breaker or can you still use a 50 Amp since you wont be drawing more than that from the 2nd box ?

 

[Buds Buddy]

I was considering changing the main house Box to one with 4 more slots & have the A/C guy wire it. I could then use the existing wiring for the outlets & lights & just run separate wiring for the A/C.
Not sure which way to go.

 

[Edzzed]

You should see our house. It has 3 breaker boxes in it. When we trip a breaker (rare) we have to run around to 3 different rooms to figure out where the breaker is. When they did the house inspection, (3 people) one was an electrician, another a plumber and another a house builder. The electrician said while odd, It is legal and safe. Our hot tub at 220 volts has the breaker in our house.

 

[Hydroholic]

A sub panel will need breakers in your existing panel, and a mains panel will not, and a main will usually have two lines of 110 fed to it in case you need 220 for a baseboard heater or an air conditioner, whereas a sub panel sometimes is only one leg of 110.

You don’t want to parallel your main for another panel. Highly illegal also.

I was considering changing the main house Box to one with 4 more slots & have the A/C guy wire it. I could then use the existing wiring for the outlets & lights & just run separate wiring for the A/C.
Not sure which way to go.

If you change the main panel they will have to pull the meter. This can run into permitting issues and Electrical licensing.