LEDScrog's - Indoor - Soil - LED - Grape Ape - 2 Plant Scrog in 4x4

[ledscrog]

Welcome to my first grow. I've been planning this grow for a little over a year and the time has finally come. I've been a long time follower of this site, but just recently joined.

Any advice or tips throughout this grow is much appreciated. I've been gardening for years and have tons of experience, but not with this plant.

What strain is it? Grape Ape
Is it Indica, Sativa or Hybrid? Hybrid
What percentages? 50/50
Is it in Veg or Flower stage? Veg
If in Veg... For how long? 6 weeks
If in Flower stage... For how long? N/A
Indoor or outdoor? Indoor
Soil or Hydro? Soil
If soil... what is in your mix? Store bought generic potting soil
If soil... What size pot? 23 gallon
Size of light? 650 true watts (led)
Is it aircooled? Yes
Temp of Room/cab? 70-78°
RH of Room/cab? 40-60%
PH of media or res? Unknown
Any Pests ? No
How often are you watering? Every 3rd day currently
Type and strength of ferts used? Fox Farm trio pack, 1/3 strength.

I'm posting a few pictures of the trip along the way so far.

About a week ago I transplanted into 23 gallon pots and built a 46"x46" screen.

My plants responded to the transplanting within a day and started showing signs of new growth. This was also the time I labeled my plants 1 & 2

These are the pictures that were taken today, I messed up when I topped plant 1.

Thanks for stopping by, I'll try to post a update every 3 days but it may go a little bit longer.

 

[NuttyProfessor]

welcome to the forum , all looking good so far . enjoy

 

[ledscrog]

I've decided to update this thread today and to ask some questions.

My plants new growth has been amazing, the plants responded well to 1/3 strength nutrients and I am looking forward to their next feeding. Tonight I checked them and the soil was telling me to water so I did after I snapped a few pictures.

I'm still embarrassed about plant 1's first topping oh well, rookie mistake number 1, the rest of the new growth looks amazing.

Plant 2 is just great. Nothing new to report except tons of new growth.

To finish off the update portion of this post here's a group shot.

Next on my list are a few questions I need experienced advice or recommendations.

My first is the undergrowth, perticulary on the first node. Should I remove these shoots? Their growth rate is next to nothing. The picture below shows the growth in question.

Next question, with a scrog setup like I have should I try to encourage plant stretching? I'm looking to have my current tops about 8" towards the sides of the tent (lst) before the next topping. If this is a good idea how do I accomplish this? If this is a bad idea could you explain why?

Thanks for the help anyone can offer.

 

[LedLWCFogPon]

Its all personal preference in the end really! I personally would let it stretch slightly!! Not too much at all of course tho; you can achieve that faster by raising the light id say about 3-4 more inch's by the looks of their squatyness. The reason I do not like mine too, too squat is that the buds will overshadow themselves later on if their too close. Buds like a ton of light penetration all around them of course just as the plant the more light they can receive all around them the more plump and bigger they will be up to their genetic/strain potential besides fert's/nute's/beneficial bacteria's and sugar boosters light is also key. They look really nice by the way. The only thing id do (again as my preference for better light distribution over all) is tie the two top branches back so they can get way more light on the growth that's being shadowed (for example on plant #2) below which will greatly help the other branches grow vary nearly as fast as the two tops and also keep the plant more uniformed. Uniformity is one of the main purposes of scrog besides obtaining more so even light distribution for the plant. Oh yeah I am sure that you know as well (as I seen in your gal. photos as a avid gardener) make sure, but mentioning justtt in-case, to use something softer like garden twine to tie them back with to not cut into the plant or damage it. Not sure if I explained well enough or if I gave you any useful info? Hope that helps in some way at least!! I can try to explain it more if your not sure what I mean. Feel free to ask if you would like to know more.

 

[db003]

holy sweet huge pots batman... those have to be the biggest pots I have ever seen I transplant my clones strait in to 3 gallon pots and will be flowering in them I am also on my first grow also with leds and am going to scrog a bit I will sub your grow journal now I want bigger pots

 

[ledscrog]

LedLWCFogPon - Thanks for the advice. The day after my last update my plants started their LST. I iincreased the light height to 30" in a attempt to control a increased temperature in my tent, next on my list I increased the output of red spectrum light to possibly increase the amount of stretching in my plants.

You are correct about me gardening. I have 3 large greenhouses (maybe ill start a post in the other gardening section I've found here) on my property and looking to add another pending approval from local law enforcement. But as I'm sure most know there is a learning curve to every plant you grow - my plants are currently in week 7 of veg, but much smaller then they should be. At week 2 my plants had stretched to 7 inches tall and started falling over, I replanted them leaving 1 inch to the water leaves, it took 3 weeks to recover from this stress, as a result the root mass is much larger which could be bennificial - on the down side the seeds are from a hermi plant so I could be paying for it later.

Db003 - the pots are large, but not sure if truly necessary at this point. I have larger but without a extended veg time I'm not sure if there would be any benefits besides knowing you won't wound up root bound. Larger pots support larger root mass in my experience, I think I could fit 4 this size in my tent, but could probably fit 9+ 5 gallon pots and run less veg time and probably still have the same harvest, I'm testing these pots for a possible greenhouse grow next year (~50 plants)

 

[ledscrog]

Time for a quick update.

On April 19th I followed the advice in this thread Increasing yield with defoliation indoors - What's it mean? How to do it? I removed six fan leaves and began low stress training.

Yesterday I watered my plants with one gallon of water each with 4 teaspoons of grow big and 4 teaspoons of big bloom. the plants have recovered from the defoliation and low stress training.

The only issue at this time plant one suffered some wind burn, the new growth looks fine and I repositioned the fan.

 

[LedLWCFogPon]

Aww you were already one step ahead of me even! No prob. again that's why wasn't sure if I mentioned anything useful for you. I think you did mention LSTing already actually and should have known you planned to as I see the holes you drilled around your pot (great idea) that's exactly what I was trying to explain... perfect tie down actually!! I do not have experience with LEDs yet but I've read so, so much on them (like for hours on end and some months). I am going to order some Build My Owns strips, very soon actually, for my future stealth set up. Anyway I think your right about setting them into the red spec. end for a bit. I am assuming that should make them stretch a bit more too; then go back to more blues of course once you got your desired results. Some people would freak out hearing about wanting to stretch them but again I do not let them go too much tho; jussst enough to get a bit of spacing out for future bud development. I do not like them too stretchy of course still. Not sure if you have any choice of mixing a tiny bit of ultra violet colors on your LED? If you could (if can) mix a bit in with the red will help to build the stalk up while you grow to stretch a bit. It also helps produce colors in your plants. I find building up stalk is kinda necessary when growing for a bit of stretch to keep the branches more thick and robust I believe assist in growing fatter buds as well; but that's just my theory that I know of. Again looking really good there.

 

[LedLWCFogPon]

P.s. Of course hermi. plants are one way of producing female seeds actually so you should be fine. I think the percentage of them being herms. later on are low with good conditions and adequate environment. It's too much stress & stressful grow conditions that usually make them herm. more so; but of course your in the hands of genetics which ultimately decides. They are showing female tendencies but that's a mere assumption. I've had plants at times that I thought without a doubt were female but turn out to be male as well but only the odd occasion still with the naturally stouter growing plants.

 

[ledscrog]

My light is a 12 band model that isn't a sponsor. With me already receiving one warning I'm going to stop talking about it.

I'll finish this post later I just broke my phone and it won't let me type right.

 

[ledscrog]

Another update, a bit late but here it is.

Plant 1 has really started to take off, but 2 is leaving it behind. Either way, plants are looking great and starting to show signs of presex.

Plant 1

Plant 2

 

[ledscrog]

I do not have experience with LEDs yet but I've read so, so much on them (like for hours on end and some months).

First sorry about the last response, I only use my phone to access this site. I didn't mean for it to be so short and realize it might have sounded a bit rude.
I understand how you feel, I've been looking for about a year before I finally chose to drop some serious money. In the end I chose the light I did based on it's features. Wish they were a sponsor, I haven't seen a single grow using these lights.

I am going to order some Build My Owns strips, very soon actually, for my future stealth set up.

Care to share any details? I actually thought about this but decided to buy a light instead. What are some of the features on the strips (wattage, lens angle, driver type...). I'm doing a separate testing with a home built cob design with some pepper plants.

Anyway I think your right about setting them into the red spec. end for a bit. I am assuming that should make them stretch a bit more too; then go back to more blues of course once you got your desired results. Some people would freak out hearing about wanting to stretch them but again I do not let them go too much tho; jussst enough to get a bit of spacing out for future bud development. I do not like them too stretchy of course still.

I think it was helpful, my plants are growing about 1 inch or more a day. Stretching them is a risk, but if the results are good that's all that matters. I run them high in red spectrum the day after watering then reduce it to roughly 3:1 blue/red the following days. On the last high red day I had 3 inches of vertical growth and retrained the following day.

Not sure if you have any choice of mixing a tiny bit of ultra violet colors on your LED? If you could (if can) mix a bit in with the red will help to build the stalk up while you grow to stretch a bit. It also helps produce colors in your plants. I find building up stalk is kinda necessary when growing for a bit of stretch to keep the branches more thick and robust I believe assist in growing fatter buds as well; but that's just my theory that I know of. Again looking really good there.

Theory? Stay tuned, I've been blasting them with both UV and IR (about 30 watts of each) since I put my new light up. The stocks are getting thick, as seen in my recent update. I'll get a updated picture with size reference next update.

P.s. Of course hermi. plants are one way of producing female seeds actually so you should be fine. I think the percentage of them being herms. later on are low with good conditions and adequate environment. It's too much stress & stressful grow conditions that usually make them herm. more so; but of course your in the hands of genetics which ultimately decides. They are showing female tendencies but that's a mere assumption. I've had plants at times that I thought without a doubt were female but turn out to be male as well but only the odd occasion still with the naturally stouter growing plants.

The dispensary where I purchased my seeds claimed they were fem, but I'm hearing a lot of review's claiming full blown males :/ . I'll hope for the best but I can't tell the sexes yet. Next update I'll attempt to get some decent pictures with a 12MP camera and then see what the community here thinks.

In terms of a more up to date report on the plants: I've trained the top branches back down, once I finished the LST I defoliated fan leaves that were blocking light to new growth and once again the new growth thrived. Other than that not much news, plants were watered with 1 gallon of water (well water with constant 6.7PH).

On other news I clipped the lower 2 branches that were not going to reach the canopy, I will be working on reshaping the LST to reflect having 6 main arms instead of 8 during the next few days as I have time.

On a side note I started 12 new seeds (I'll order more seeds soon) to play with and answer questions and gain experience about training, lighting and stress techniques and possibly save some pollen for later breeding.

Unfortunately that's all the time I have at the moment. Until next time.

 

[LedLWCFogPon]

Oh No prob. u did mention your phone was bust! Guess you got that fixed Anyway I actually just ordered my first strip of a build my own couple days ago now. The build is in process of being made now by machine and hand. It's just as it sounds they have 12" sizes up to 48" as long as you want them then you can choose what colors you want in your strip (LED light) so its custom. You have to choose what colors they have available but its a good enough selection it hits on peak levels of the spectrum's (colors) that are the most beneficial for the plants growth anyway. The only thing of course is its super expensive its much cheaper or still cheaper to buy the highest end commercial LED out there. The other plus is they are professional grade (same kinds made for the pro/industrial grow labs and large scale medical establishments). But again at a cost. I got one 36" which is near exactly the length I needed (or I would a bought their own make which i seen amazing results from but It was a tad too wide for the cabinet I will have to use) and cost me 325 bills. I will need 4 of them so cha chingg!! Oh and you can choose other options like light beam angles although I have no idea why you wouldn't choose 90 degree; cause that's what gives you the most light spread of course from one single strip/unit rather then having to buy more to put them closer. I think 1400 dollars plus is already hefty for me in the end ha. Plus I will be buying an additional side light as well that will boost crystal production and of course help light the under growth below too; another cost of 200 ontop. I just hope it will produce amazing results at the cost so I am taking a big chance without knowing 100% for-sure.

 

[ledscrog]

Its been a while since my last update. I've been checking on the plants daily but haven't had time to post much.

The plants have started growing at a decent rate. There are a few problems I'm currently running into but I have made the necessary corrections. I had a Mg deficiency show up when I ran out of cal-mag, I have finally received my new supply in the mail and they have received a full strength dosing. Plant 1 has what i believe to be a late stage Mg or Ca but only on 2 arms.

Both plants have been feed 1 full strength feeding since the last update. Plant 2 had another round of tying done 2 days ago to even the canopy. They were both fed full strength CalMag tonight before pictures were taken.

I have started 12 more seeds (I have 8 sprouted through soil), I've chosen to grow a few smaller plants on the outside edges of the tent and to reduce the screen size. I have back and knee issues and didn't realize how the first screen allowed me no wiggle room to get under. The new screens will be built and installed tomorrow individually on each plants "tote" so I can pull a whole plant out of the tent to work on it if necessary.

Plant is looking overall healthy (Mg/Ca deficiency has been treated) with the exception on 2 arms.

Plant 2 is looking healthy for the most part (Mg/Ca deficiency has been treated), the deficiency didn't develop as fast on this plant.

 

[David Bowman]

Hope all is well in your world.

Is this grow still alive?

We would love to be updated with some pictures and info.

How about posting a 420 Strain Review?

If you need any help with posting photos, please read our Photo Gallery Tutorial.

I am moving this to Abandoned Journals until we get updates.

Sending you lots of love and positive energy.

 

[ledscrog]

Sorry for the lack of reply. Been in and out of the hospital.

Going to keep this short tonight and ill write a catch up tomorrow or the day after.

My plants are day 6 of flower, i havent personally been able to see them, these pictures are all i know. If you can help with sexing i would appreciate it.

 

[ledscrog]

Well ive gone ahead and cut both males down. It was a bit of a bummer but i learned alot during the growth of these 2. Ill get some pictures of the stems later today to post.

These were posted last night in the faq portion of the site to confirm they were male. I have 6 others started and about 3 weeks old i have them under 12/12 to confirm their sex and let the females flower.

I'll start a new journal for them later tomorrow wgen they are transplanted into 5 gallon pots.

Thabks for tagging along everyone.

 

[ledscrog]

After 2 1/2 months in the pots, 2 months swick watering the root growth really surprised me considering these are 23 gallon pots and the roots had protruded from the bottom into the perlite.

As far as root mass size, they were much larger then the pictures below. Before i dumped the pots i cut all the roots sticking out the bottom (keep in mind these pots weighed in at about 80lbs dry)

Sorry for the lack of updates during this journal, my next one will be much better as long as my health permits. Im really bummed they both turned out to be males but I learned more then i thought just off these 2 plants.

So the end result; 200 dollars in power, some nutrients and alot of time, but gained experience with growing. Stay tuned for a new grow soon featuring 6 plants.

 

[MassMedMan]

next time you start one up send me an invite I'll follow along. I like your positive mindset. Good luck, take the positive, learn from the chances, and roll with the punches. Good luck!

 

[ledscrog]

Not sure how to do a invite for a journal, I did get the link posted into my signature.